Thursday, November 8, 2018
Due Friday, November 16th - "Persuasion" by Jane Austen - Chapters 13-22, Pages 87-170
Directions: Please read Persuasion by Jane Austen - Chapters 13-22, Pages 87-170. This marks the beginning of Vol. II through climax of the novel. In this blog space, please respond to the reading using direct evidence from the text. Give your opinion and use your knowledge of Pride and Prejudice and Austen's background. Remember to respond to each other. Give feedback. Ask questions.
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Due Thursday, June 13th - All I Really Needed to Know I Learned in Mr. Pellerin's Survey of British Literature Class.
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This book has gotten so boring and it’s such a drag. I do see the similarities between Pride and Prejudice and how people would like it with relatable characters; But the thought that keeps popping up in my head is how childish these adults are acting. How Wentworth is jealous of Mr. Elliot and Anne is like hehehe. It’s an old, book version of whatever my sister watches on Netflix. (Pretty Little [stupid] Liars) I am not a fan.
ReplyDeleteTHIS IS THE BASE OF PLL? but it's not 1/2 as interesting and thats saying something cause PLL isn't the best lol
DeleteChloe ^^^
DeleteI agree with you, Colby. This book is shorter than P&P but feels longer.
DeleteProbably because it's depressing.
DeleteChloe Hanrahan
ReplyDeleteI don't know how write a blog for this because to me it is so boring. We are teenagers and deal with people acting like this on the daily, I don't wanna read about it too!
I don't like that Austen wrote Mr. Elliot to be bad. I liked him and Anne, it would've been a better story and lesson to have Anne end up with someone other than Wentworth because we all expect that. I think the only reason Austen wrote this twist is because she longed for someone in her past - not someone new. Austen lived in her past, she wrote Anne the same way and this book teaches people that living in the past can work out if you try enough. I'm a person that tends to dwell on the past and I can say it doesn't work out so perfectly usually. I'm with you Owen... I've lost my patience too dude.
No sooner than it began had I had enough!
DeleteI think Jane Austen frequently pointed out things she wasn't too crazy about, and I completely understand!
DeleteI agree, I don't like how Mr. Elliots character is portrayed, I really like his character in the book. But I also loved Wickham when he was introduced, but we all know how that ended. Of course I still love Wickham, but in a way that you would love watching a video that makes your stomach tight and your skin crawl.
DeleteI agree, I feel like there was too much self projection in Anne and Wentworth leaving less quality content to write about.
DeleteAnne meets with her family and even though she is not that excited she does enjoy the welcome that they give her.She gets the feeling of degradation from the current situation which is understandable to most except the family with the exception of Anne.Later Mr.Elliot meets up with them and finds anne pretty. It will be interesting to see the outcome of that. Captain Wentworth becomes free after a engagement of Captain Benwick and Anne hears of this. Then later Anne and Captain Wentworth come into contact unintentionally.And during this encounter there is a kind of Alpha male battle very briefly between Mr.Elliot and Wentworth. I wonder how that will result and who will be the victor and get Anne.
ReplyDeleteAnne's family really treats her as an outsider which is kinda sad for Anne. They even think of her as a lower being because they can talk to her, but Anne can't talk to them.
DeleteIn this section of reading, I feel like Jane Austen is trying to expand on her idea of a woman becoming more independent. Already throughout this book, Anne is shown as being her own type of person even without having a husband. I think another character used in this book to emphasize this point is Mrs. Smith. After she became a widow and was left with very little to no money from her husband, she continued her life. Even after she got sick and wasn’t able to move around she stayed happy and didn’t let herself get down even after all of this happened. “She watched, observed, reflected, and finally determined that this was not a case of fortitude or of resignation only. A submissive spirit might be patient, a strong understanding would supply resolution, but here was something more, here was that elasticity of mind, that disposition to be comforted, that power of turning readily from evil to good and of finding employment which her carried out herself, which was from nature alone.” (113) Prior to this quote, Anne had talked about how much Mrs. Smith had lost and very little left to live for. However, Anne realized that she doesn’t need all of those things that she had lost. Mrs. Smith was able to create something from nothing, she could create her own happiness and her own reasons for living. This clearly being a trait which she had acquired from birth. This piece from the reading completely throws the idea that a woman had to rely on her husband for her happiness, which was said in “Advice to the Newly Married Lady” by Samuel K Jennings. Here Mrs. Smith was living with no husband, relatives, or money and she was still able to find purpose in her life and enjoy what she had. Is it possible that Jane had these intentions? Did she write about women becoming more independent as more of an extreme and something that wouldn't happen or was she trying to start something new in society?
ReplyDeleteI think she was trying to start something new.
DeleteGuys these chapters are boring but steamy. I thought Pride and Prejudice was funny because the characters were generally around our age, a bit older, and they acted like how we act today. But reading this book with the characters older, my one question is why are they still acting like teenagers?! When Captain Wentworth was jealous of Mr. Elliot and said “there is nothing worth my staying for”(141) he seems like a petty 14 year-old in my opinion! Isn’t he around 30-40? Shouldn’t he be acting at least A LITTLE BIT more mature than this? Even Darcy was more mature than him. Off that topic a bit, I can relate to Anne’s thoughts before visiting Kellynch Hall: “So ended all danger to Anne of meeting Captain Wentworth… or seeing him in company with her friend. Everything was safe enough” (94). She thinks all will be fine and normal, but little did she know she’d be encountering Mr. Elliot. Part of me is becoming frustrated with the book while also enjoying Jane’s work. I like Jane’s writing, I just don’t appreciate how the story is laid out. Pride and Prejudice was a much more interesting read for me.
ReplyDeleteI've lost my patience with this book. I'm with you, Owen, as well.
DeleteEhh...that's one way to describe this book. Idk I'm just not feeling it with Persuasion like I did with Pride and Prejudice, I mean I'm not saying its a completely bad book its just not my favorite and it kinda takes me awhile to read because of how bored I usually get. On a different note Louisa and Captain Benwick being engaged to each other actually surprised me and I felt like their engagement came out of the blue, "But now for Louisa. I have something to communicate that will astonish you not a little. She and the Harvilles came on Tuesday very safely, and in the evening we went to ask her how she did, when we were rather surprised not to find Captain Benwick of the party, for he had been invited as well as the Harvilles; what do you think was the reason? Neither more nor less than his being in love with Louisa" (p.121). I mean I guess this is a good thing, leaving Captain Wentworth available for Anne but at the same time do I really care? No not really.
ReplyDeleteThe plot of this story seems quite similar to that of Pride and Prejudice. It's like all of the main characters who are in love are playing "hard-to-get". For example, Anne originally tries to avoid Captain Wentworth, doing anything she can to not see him. “So ended all danger to Anne of meeting Captain Wentworth of Kellynch Hall, or seeing him in company with her friend. Every thing was safe enough, and she smiled over the many anxious feelings she had wasted on the subject” (94). Basically, this quote just expresses Anne's feelings over the fact that she won't have to see Captain Wentworth visit Kellynch Hall. However, as the book progresses, Anne begins to change her feelings towards Wentworth, like how Elizabeth changed her feelings directed at Mr. Darcy, and began to actually want to meet with him and perhaps have a conversation with him.
ReplyDeleteOn another note, I still feel a little bit bad for Anne. Even though she is starting to become the center of attention of a lot of men, she is still somewhat rejected by her family. When she moved to Bath, “Her father and sister were glad to see her, for the sake of shewing her the house and furniture” (100). I feel really bad for Anne. Her family is treating her more like a distant friend rather than an actual member of the family. They just show stuff off to her, but “They had no inclination to listen to her.” (100). I don't feel like Sir Walter or Elizabeth really considers the fact that Anne is a blood member of their family.
Much like many of my peers, I begin to find this book rather tedious. I expected Persuasion to be a little more fast paced than Pride and Prejudice, but I was mistaken. I think that the 6 months after Mrs. Austen's passing(research), the later author did not write in a similar manner to that of Mrs. Austen's causing this book to seem rather drawn out, when published posthumously. Of course, this is my opinion, but it seems many of my fellow peers share this feeling.
ReplyDeleteI don't like this book as much as Pride and Prejudice. I feel this way because it drags on and is missing the certain charm that Pride and Prejudice had. Anyways I'm glad we're almost done with it to quote Owen "I have lost my patience".
ReplyDeleteAnyways in these chapters I kind of feel bad for Anne. First of all she meets up with an old friend, Mrs. Smith, and sees how great her life has panned out then she receives the news that Captain Benwick and Louisa are getting married, which kinda sucks cause I felt that him and Anne really hit it off with their poetry talk. I mean I know the book is going to end happily but it's gonna take a miracle.
I thought Pride and Prejudice was tedious, but Persuasion is going nowhere! They just keep arguing about their relationships, and it's torture! I honestly don't know what these remaining 18 pages will lead to.
ReplyDeleteAnd with only 18 pages left, why did we have to stop?🛑⁉
DeleteIf we didn't leave on a cliffhanger then there wouldn't be anymore predictions to be made.
DeleteBut we were almost there, we could've kept going!
DeleteIn any case, I can't believe how many of you understand my impatience! This is awesome!
DeleteI liked reading these chapters because the plot finally begins to pick up a little. The newly introduced Mr Elliot reminds me of an intermingled Mr Collins and Mr Wickham, possessing the character of Wickham and the intentions of Collins. He is like Mr Collins because each have cousin relations with the Elliot's and the Bennets. However, he seems to be interested in Anne, but does not seem to be talking openly with her, which makes me very dubious of why he suddenly chooses to become re-acquainted with Anne and her family. Meanwhile, Anne is having the time of her life with these two suitors constantly competing for her affections. I believe that Anne is more interested in the Captain and always has been, and I think Mr Elliot is a more perilous alternative to Wentworth. I hope Anne is not foolish in her choice and am looking forward to the events that unfold with the suspicious Mr Elliot.
ReplyDeleteThroughout these chapters we learn that it is obvious that Mr. Elliot and Anne would not make the best couple, and we later learn the true character of Mr Elliot. An example of them being a bad couple is on page 110. Mr. Elliot says that good company is “family connexion”, and Anne responds by saying “My idea of good company, Mr Elliot, is the company of clever, well-informed people, who have a great deal of conversation; that is what I call good company” (110). Another example is on page 133 when Anne talks about how the Elliots spent most of their evenings at “private parties” which she describes as stupid, and how Captain Wentworth went to the theatre which she would much rather attend. So we learn that Mr Elliot would not be a good match for her because they don’t really have the same interests. Later we learn from Mrs Smith that Mr Elliot is actually a very cruel man. So now Mr Elliot and Anne being in a relationship is not even a possibility for Anne because she does not like him.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing that was interesting was the part where Anne was at the concert and was looking for Captain Wentworth. This reminded me of Pride and Prejudice when Elizabeth was looking for Wickham at the dance. It also reminded me of Jane Austen looking for Tom Lefroy at the dance in the movie “Becoming Jane”. I like how we can connect these pieces by Jane Austen and we can also connect them to her life.
Mr. Elliot reminds me of Mr. Collins, somewhat.
DeleteI feel that Mr. Elliot and Mr. Collins have a Grinchy characteristic to them, but maybe i'm wrong ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
DeleteI think they're more like Ebeneezer Scrooge than the Grinch.
DeleteI also saw that similarity, all 3 looking for someone in a room. You can truly tell feelings by who you look for in a room where you don't even know if they'll be there.
DeleteAlright boys and girls, this was a treat. Anne is clearly feeling herself, as she boldly admits Wentworth had "Jealousy of Mr. Elliot! It was the only intelligible motive. Captain Wentworth jealous of her affection!" (141). Like, bold of you to assume he had feelings for you, Anne, but I like some confidence in your spirit. I mean, we obviously can tell from Wentworth not being able to be in a room with her without getting all shy and embarrassed. But Anne's confidence boost really helped. I knew being the subject of a harem on the beach would do her good.
ReplyDeleteI don't like Mrs. Smith. She's shady, even if she helps Anne in the end. She kinda looks for her own benefit over Anne's happiness. She thinks Mr. Elliot is okayish now, but she knows he was "a man without heart or conscience" (147). And she still tried to pair em up so she could make bank and buy herself a new wheelchair. Like, no.
Austen clearly followed similar patterns with Pride and Prejudice and Persuasion. MC has conflict with love interest, get closer, major pull back, revelation, get closer, MORE pull back, only to have a real romantic moment in the end and happily ever after. However, in Pride we saw real confirmation of Darcy's feelings for Elizabeth, something lacking for Wentworth's feelings for Anne. We don't even know if they're really there or if she's delusional (like I know we do because Wentworth is obvious and how can you not love Anne?? but still). Pride and Prejudice had a more recognizable storyline while Persuasion seems more rushed and confusing, most likely due to her state of being when writing it.
Anyway, still 10/10 would read again. Can't wait for the last like 2 pages ig. :ppppp
In these very long chapters, I really like how Anne is getting herself back up her feet and trying to find her identity, in where she stands with all of the people she is associated with. One of my favorite traits that I love seeing in Jane Austen’s books is how the female protagonist always seem to have a force to be reckoned with, with other characters that seem to challenge them, whether because of one’s status, wealth, or gender role in the social hierarchy of the Regency Era. One quote that I really like that Anne said was when her father was appalled that she wasn’t joining them to meet people of higher status, the Dalrymples, asking why she would do social suicide to herself, and she replies with, “ but I do not think I can put off my engagement, because it is the only evening for some time which will at and for the rest of the week you know we are engaged.” (116) That quote in itself had so much power and confidence, and in the beginning, I think we all thought that Anne wasn’t the most outgoing person and usually didn’t speak her mind in the novel, but when she rejected her father’s wishes for the first time in forever, I think she was not only ready to be assertive, but also be judged for the right reasons from her perspective. I feel like if Anne hadn’t gone to see her sister Mary and meet Captain Wentworth and all of the people she met along the way, there would be no way she would’ve said. Anne’s character has developed a lot, considering she not only knows how people around her might think but also understands why they might think this way and how she can help them and be useful because she barely had anything to do when she was with her father and older sister, Elizabeth. In Pride and Prejudice, we also see that in Elizabeth, especially when she made up her own mind and said that she was gonna do things her way, and having those types of characters that make women feel empowered, is something that Jane Austen does really well in her novels.
ReplyDeleteWith Pride and Prejudice and even the beginning of this novel, I was always entertained by what was happening and enjoyed reading it. However, the section of the book, with a few exceptions, seemed very dull to me and was a struggle to read because of that. Despite that, I still though there were some interesting things that occurred during the reading. Anne has changed a large amount over the course of the novel and those changes are very clear in these chapters. When visiting her friend from school a long time before, it was described that “Twelve years jad changed Anne from the blooming, silent, unformed girl of fifteen, to the elegant little woman of seven and twenty, with every beauty excepting bloom, and with manners as consciously right as they were invariably gentle” (112). Although this transformation did not take place during the reading, rather it occurred a good amount of time before, Anne’s transformation is still clear. As for Anne changing in the book, she has become considerably bolder and is willing to stand up for herself now, whereas previously, she was quite shy, timid, and let other walk all over her. When Sir Walter says that her friend, Mrs. Smith is old and tells Anne to put off her meeting with her until the day after because the family was to meet with Lady Dalrymple, Anne responds with “No, Sir, she is not one and thirty; but I do not think I can put off my engagement, because it is the only evening for some time which will at once suit her and myself.–She goes into the warm bath to-morrow, and for the rest of the week you know we are engaged” (116). Anne has begun to stand up for herself to her father, as shown with the example, and in general, has become significantly less timid and shy.
ReplyDeleteOn a different note, I found it funny how Lady Russell was aware of the feelings Mr. Elliot had for Anne, and yet she does not outright tell Anne about them, instead says something vaguely about “if Mr Elliot should some time hence pay his addresses to you, and if you should be disposed to accept him, I think there would be every possibility of your being happy together. A most suitable connexion every body must consider it – but I think it might be a very happy one” (117). Lady Russell seems to want Anne to figure out his feelings for herself, but still does want them to get together, so she plays matchmaker slightly, simply putting ideas about a happy marriage between them into her head
In this chapter I found it very surprising how quickly the relationship between Captain Wentworth and Louisa came to a close after her injury. Before she got hurt, Wentworth and Louisa were spending almost all of their time together: walking on the beach, and talking on long walks in the woods. However, once Louisa got hurt and started spending more time in the seclusion of the house with Benwick...they grew an affinity for one another. However, I wonder if this affinity grew out the suppressed nature of her emotions caused by her injury. So, when Louisa gets her strength back, there is a good chance that Benwick will not be able to keep up with her passionate energy after it is not not contained. However, this leads an opportunity for Anne to make a move on Captain Wentworth. I beleive Anne (despite not talking to Wentworth much during her time in Upercross) had a pleasant time. I feel like Anne revealed this emotion when she told Mr. Elliot, "The last few hours were ceratainly very painful...but when pain is over, the rememberance of it often becomes a pleasure"(136).
ReplyDeleteOk so this is my second time writing this because it was deleted so I am mad. This section was long and I feel like alot happened but it didn't happen. I liked Anns new confidence even though it is more like she has nothing to lose The news about Mr.Elliot really suprised me becasue I thought he was not a wickham but he his when Mrs.Smith said "he was very unkind to his first wife. They were wentched together and he did not love her. I know this is a short one but I don't have much to say I like presuation less than pride and prejudice. I wish they may be did a flash back of her in the past and how its so different than she is at the beginning and making the change a bigger.
ReplyDeleteI don't really like this book. Its kinda a drag. In Pride and Prejudice you could at least have these bursts of comedy from Mr. Bennett, or some witty remarks from Elizabeth. But all of these characters are so so so boring. Maybe this is what life was actually like and Pride and Prejudice was just a best case scenario. Regardless, it was much more interesting to read and watch than this was. This book has such a melancholy feel to it and I miss the happiness that was exhibited in Pride and Prejudice.
ReplyDeleteI am, like Chloe and Owen, pretty bored of the book. I fin few things that I'm interested besides Annes character because I feel like I relate to her in a lot of ways. I relate to her that she is the main character and this is her story, but she is written as a quiet, background character, who not many people like her because go how her mind works. Although Anne is a quiet girl, I love how she goes against the grain of her family. I love that when her father and sister were going on and bragging about how good things were going for them, "Anne was renewing an acquaintance of a very different description"(111). Anne knew that she had an old friend in Bath who was a widow. During the visit its very apparent that this made Mr.Smith very happy that she was there. I love Anne for this. I also love how they showed it in the movie, how her father was mad and pretty much said "why would you ruin your good name for this," but she did it anyway. In my opinion, it brought a greater meaning to the name of Anne Elliot.
ReplyDeleteWe're not the only ones to confess the ambient boredom.
DeleteLike most people responded on this blog, I too feel very bored with this book. It's actually a bit degrading to my mind. That's not to say it's a bad book by any means. All I'm saying is that like an ex-lover, I've lost feelings for this book. As Owen has stated multiple times in class, he has lost his patience for the book, and sadly, I have as well. Given that I quite enjoyed P&P, it seems that I am more interested in Austen's purposely comedic works, rather than her darker works. Maybe it was Mr. Bennett's witty comments on every situation the family found themselves in, or maybe it was something else. But this book does not have that... *charm* that P&P did. And I'm sad to say that I tried to like this book as much as P&P, but I unfortunately do not.
ReplyDeleteSir Elliot’s obsession over class is a bit hypocritical. Anne meets up with an old friend, Mrs.Smith, and we learn that in the past she “married a man of fortune” but he died 2 years later (112). When Sir Elliot learns that Anne will be visiting her, he calls Mrs.Smith “a widow”, “one of the five thousand”, and “old and sickly”(115). She was part of the higher class in the past but over lost that after her husband deceased. The Elliots are in a less extreme situation but they are also rapidly declining in importance with their buildup of debt. Sir Elliot scoffs at her even though he could be in her position in the future. As I was reading, I knew that Mr.Elliot wasn’t a good person but hearing him described as “beyond the reach of any sentiment of justice or compassion” and being “black at heart” caught my attention (147). It’s almost impressive how single handedly destroyed the Smith family just for a bit of profit. He is pretty much the personification of greed. His character is similar to Mr.Wickham from Pride and Prejudice in the way that they would both beg others for help and then push them off a cliff after they get it. I wonder if Persuasion will end like Pride and Prejudice where both people confess their love and get married at the very end or if there will be a different outcome.
ReplyDeleteThis reading section really was a lot. It was like the last section was all exposition and this was rising action, climax, falling action and resolution thrown together (admittedly well). Anne went to this hideous place called Bath, where people are all happy and fancy; everything Anne doesn't like! She kept going to flirt-town with her cousin and Capt. Wentworth got very very jealous. Captain Wentworth had a breakdown during a concert and had to leave because he thought Anne was ignoring his attempts of love. Whack! Anne didn't actually realize that Capt. Wentworth liked her, but when she was arguing with Captain Harville and Wentworth left her a note that had his confession of love. Also Mr. Elliot wants to marry Anne because he committed tax fraud and is a scumbag. C'est la vie!
ReplyDeleteI found Lady Russell and Anne's conversation in chapter 13 very interesting. It was stated that "But happily, either Anne was improved in plumpness and looks, or Lady Russell fancied her so; and Anne, in receiving her compliments on the occasion, had the amusement of connecting them with the silent admiration of her cousin." First I found it interesting how an improved plumpness would have been found as a compliment back then, because nowadays if you were to tell someone that they have an improved plumpness you would most definitely not get the kindest of responses. I also found it interesting how after she said that, it stated that she found an amusement in considering the connection of how she was seen of an increased beauty and/or plumpness and the silent admiration of her cousin. The first part of what she said already wouldn't have made sense in todays time, but this would have made her sound extremely creepy. She's saying how she likes how her cousin could be checking her out, and although I understand how this could have made sense 200 years ago, in my 21st century mind she sounds like a weirdo, or as one in England might say, a bloody nonce. At the beginning of chapter 17, Mrs. Smith gives me a perfect example of the failures of a society that is unaccepting. She married a rich man, and once he died, she was left with nothing. Not only that, but she unfortunately contracted an illness not very long after the death. The illness was very unfortunate, but had she been given a fair opportunity from birth she would have most likely been able to support herself, and the death of her husband wouldn't have been such a destructive event to her life.
ReplyDeleteF. Darcy: Good Afternoon Captain Wentworth, my name is Mr. Fitzwilliam Darcy, you may know me as a character from the book Pride and Prejudice.
ReplyDeleteCpt. Wentworth: Good Afternoon Mr. Darcy. I don’t remember hearing that you were coming to Kellynch today.
F. Darcy: I did not announce my arrival, it has come to my attention that our books were authored by the same person, I have not come across any of her other novels yet, but I have heard that there are others. After having read both of our novels I have determined that mine is better.
Cpt. Wentworth: I do believe that your opinion may be a bit biased, based upon the fact that you are one of the good characters in Pride and Prejudice, and not in Persuasion. I, personally, believe that Persuasion is indeed better than Pride and Prejudice.
F. Darcy: I, then, shall present my evidence. First, my book has more humor than yours and it has better humor. Second, actions of mine tend to come from somewhere, where as your letter to Anne seemed out of the blue. And Third, while I attempted to court Elizabeth I was not running around with other girls after she said no the first time.
Cpt. Wentworth: The quality of Humor cannot be measured, therefore saying that it has better humor is completely subjective. Also our humor is mostly jabs at Anne and I about Marriage but they’re unintentional because they don’t know about our past together.
F. Darcy: There are also much lower stakes in your story, in Pride and Prejudice Mr. Wickham is trying to have an affair with Lydia Bennet, and if it weren’t for me they would not have gotten married. And you have not addressed my other statements.
Cpt. Wentworth: As for your second and third points, I can admit that it seemed like my actions came from nowhere because the book does not often portray my point of view, As for your third point, those women were seeking me out, I simply tolerated them. I had no intention to marry or have any intimate relations with either of them. I will also admit that the stakes are lower, but people do have medical emergencies in our book, like falling out of trees or falling off of stairs.
F. Darcy: Jane Bingley got deathly ill. We still beat you with medical emergencies.
Cpt. Wentworth: What is this a competition now?
F. Darcy: Well if we’re arguing about whose book is better, then probably.
Cpt. Wentworth: Well at least my most attractive quality isn’t money.
F. Darcy: At least my character was good enough to attract the person I loved after they had been so repulsed by me, instead of repulsing those attracted to me. Also, my most attractive quality is the fact that I will go out of my way to ensure the happiness and wellbeing of others.
Cpt. Wentworth: How can we determine objectively whose book is better? Isn’t quality completely subjective.
F. Darcy: Quality is subjective up to a point. You can’t expect anyone to like a dilapidated one room house that has broken plumbing over a millionaire’s mansion.
Cpt. Wentworth: Are you calling my book a dilapidated one room house with no plumbing?
F. Darcy: No, but the fact that you would assume that I am says a lot about your book.